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Altar in child now give information about SoT and OoT #2338

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@RawZ06 RawZ06 commented Dec 11, 2024

This PR adds the ability to see the item on OoT and the Song at SoT on the Altar as a child. The goal is to make the child altar more useful, as it is rarely checked. The information about which dungeon corresponds to which specific stone isn’t very relevant since the three child dungeons can be deduced by reading the adult altar.

Additionally, this kind of information is crucial early in a seed and can completely change routing when, for example, you learn that Nocturne is on AD.

Currently, I’ve set the display to be conditional on misc_hints.altar being enabled. I’m not sure if I should create a specific option for this in misc_hints, such as altar-oot, for example.

image

@RawZ06 RawZ06 force-pushed the child-altar-oot-hint branch from 90fdd79 to dfbc636 Compare December 11, 2024 08:57
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fenhl commented Dec 11, 2024

This definitely needs to be a separate option.

@fenhl fenhl added Type: Enhancement New feature or request Status: Needs Review Someone should be looking at it Component: Hints related to how we help the player Status: Needs Testing Probably should be tested Status: Under Consideration Developers are considering whether to accept or decline the feature described Racing Impact Changes a mechanic in a way that impacts the balance of competitive racing. Component: Setting specific to setting(s) and removed Racing Impact Changes a mechanic in a way that impacts the balance of competitive racing. labels Dec 11, 2024
@RawZ06 RawZ06 force-pushed the child-altar-oot-hint branch from 3d3ed04 to 30b81ce Compare December 11, 2024 09:46
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RawZ06 commented Dec 11, 2024

I added an option in misc_hints.

@r0bd0g
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r0bd0g commented Dec 11, 2024

'Reuniting the stones' also maybe leads to 4 checks in the mask shop, or one check in the deku theatre, or maybe you're on stone bridge so it actually unlocks whatever's across that, so I'm not sure if 'Reuniting the stones' is the best way to word this text. I'm not sure the altar is the right place to hint these checks (I'm not sure where is the right place though), since the altar is supposed to be about your boss rewards and your win condition, and OoT, despite the amount of importance we players tend to place on it, is really just another check. If it's about what the dungeon rewards directly lead to, why aren't the Nocturne, LACS, or Prelude checks on the adult altar? Or if it's some flavour of dungeon reward bridge, why isn't the Ganon's entrance on the altar?

I'm not sure, I think you probably do need to do something, to have some sort of logic to have it so if your OoT misc hint is on and the altar hint is reachable, then no gossip stone hints for these checks appear in the seed.

I saw an image where it said in the text whether the checks were 'required' or 'not required' and I caution against the use of that kind of language. It's pretty easy to imagine, Requiem on OoT for a key in child side you don't actually need, and yet the text would say it's 'required'. Or imagine both checks are your only available Bows. Both would say 'not required' since logically you could get either one as your first bow, despite one of them definitely being required. We don't have a good way of calculating whether an item might be 'soft required' in cases like this. So this is why we use terms like "way of the hero" and "foolish choice" since determining what actually is or isn't required is not so simple.

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r0bd0g commented Dec 19, 2024

Just had a thought, I don't know that it's normal that a check would be hinted if it's not shuffled.

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Component: Hints related to how we help the player Component: Setting specific to setting(s) Status: Needs Review Someone should be looking at it Status: Needs Testing Probably should be tested Status: Under Consideration Developers are considering whether to accept or decline the feature described Type: Enhancement New feature or request
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