Replies: 8 comments 7 replies
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Here's what the raw data looks like:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Yu98tDRhFJqqMntNak6X297SKyzQtf0_Cvv_g7qKewk/edit#gid=0 It's definitely possible to guess, but it's lots of coding work and still requires the user to verify everything. |
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But that can't be true. I mean the ESP code obvioulsy just get this same data and then makes the decision which of the three PV values to use, without the user verifying anything. I think this is what Emporia calls 'locking the channels', which btw also in their process actually isn't 100% error free, so thinking of that, what you're saying is that if you want to do it even BETTER than what emporia does, then yes, the user would need to verify things. BTW, Emporia themselves suggest to turn on all equipment in your house when having the software calculate what is what. And I guess they then just take the most positive value each time? |
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Interesting… any idea how the stock firmware/app is able to figure it out?
…On Tue, Sep 26, 2023 at 9:40 PM Flaviu Tamas ***@***.***> wrote:
Here's what the raw data looks like:
[image: image]
<https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/5213469/270836292-2c9c7fd5-06b7-4322-b099-36e2ababd160.png>
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Yu98tDRhFJqqMntNak6X297SKyzQtf0_Cvv_g7qKewk/edit#gid=0
It's definitely possible to guess, but it's lots of coding work and still
requires the user to verify everything.
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Like said in my above reply, Emporia suggest to turn on all equipment in your house when the firmware does the 'channel locking', as how they call it, which is the process of deciding which phase belongs to which of the 16 smaller CT's. I think after that they just take the most positive value. Which, again, might not be errorfree, you can call emporia helpline and they can then change that online for you if you think the automatic process made an error. |
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Could it be as easy as using the most positive of the three readings for each CT clamp? Looking quickly through that spreadsheet and the reversing repo's examples, it seems like that could work. It seems usually two out of three are negative, but if two are positive, then the one that is larger looks like the desired value. There may be some issues for very small power measurements however; i.e., circuits only using 1 or 2 watts at a given point in time. Also there could be some issues between 2-phase and 3-phase power setups that I am not considering. |
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Does the device actually report power, or does it ignore phase shift? |
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It calculates real power—see #213 (comment) for what the raw data looks like. |
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But is that also transmitted to HA? There are many posts that report that apparent power is included. |
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Sorry, I misunderstood your question. Only apparent power is included. See #2 for more details. |
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Hm, in Europe, true Power is billed, apparent power not. This does not seem to be a limitation of the esphome firmware, if I interpret #2 right ... Why does it need a connection to each phase then? And why do I need to specify what phase each clamp is on? In the screenshot above, it seems that three power values are calculated, one assuming per (assumed) phase... Just to be sure: |
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What is the meaning of P(V1) in contrast to P(V2) and P(V3) above? |
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So to add to this thread, according to Emporia their own firmware shows true power, not apparent power. HOWEVER on (most?) 3 phase setups this is incorrect and the emporia seems to measure apparent power on the 50A clamps. According to Emporia this is a bug that they're aware of “Its the way we see and lock 3 phase and there’s no easy way to fix that” they said. They also said "we are always making changes to the database so it will get fixed one way another but dont know how long" |
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However I wonder if there's any way we could fix this ourselves? |
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In addition to this thread ... I just only realized that Emporia doesnt even really 'lock' the phases. I haven't tried it yet with this community firmware but I understand that with the YAML file you really lock a phase to a CT, correct @flaviut ? Emporia doesn't do that! Which of course makes no sense at all :) But I just tested it. I'm running some tests to find out why it seems to show reactive power instead of active power in some cases. So when for example my Airconditioner is on, there are 3 power values for the 3 phases. The first is positive, the other 2 negative, Emporia correctly selects the positive first one when the Airconditioner is on. But when I turn off the airconditioner, the first power value becomes negative, the second positive and the 3rd negative and then Emporia simply selects the second one. Which of course is wrong and this is why they show a WAY too high value for my AC in standby. Anyway, still looking to fix this, but i was kind of surprised to learn the above so I thought I'd post it here. So it seems Emporia doesn't really locks the phases but they always seem to select the most positive one. Even if that means that sometimes they pick phase 1 then phase 2 for the same CT, LOL. |
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Hello, well, as the App does not allow an association of phase <-> channel, there must be some "magic". Probably, that was seen too complex for the average user. Greetings, |
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It seems that the official Emporia app doesn't require you to specify which phase each CT clamp is associated with. This lets you avoid recompiling/reflashing just to adjust for cable management purposes
Any idea how they do that?
Is there a way to get the Emporia Vue esphome config to auto-detect phase in that way?
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