-
|
Hello again! I am working on my OB-8 Tauntek Panel and have run into some problems testing. The panel itself is working fine and the functionalities of the controls are as they should be, but when automating parameters I fear the messages get to dense and overload the modest Z-80 processor. I am also running into this issue on the much more complicated Jupiter 8 panel I have been working on, but since the OB-8 panel is all CC controls I figured this would not be an issue. Unfortunately, when automating some parameters and then sending note information, several stuck notes result. Also Tauntek did not seem to implement the basic midi panic control on CC 123 or any other so it requires an annoying hard reset. Is there a way to slow down or thin out modulators simply before sending them from controller? Could the issue be that the DAW is sending midi notes and the panel is sending CC data and they are getting mushed up somehow? Midi snapshot seems to be working well but I must fix this issue before I move on to patch saving with json. Here's an image of the interface in its current state
|
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
Replies: 9 comments 40 replies
-
|
This was discussed in this thread. Some sample code is there, but you'll likely need to adapt it. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
I have the same issue with a Panel for Ensoniq that I am working on. Every message needs at least 200ms so going from 0 to 25 with a slider sends all the sysex lines from 0 to 25. You could go the route that Godlike-Productions suggests. For me that is not even what I want. I don't want people scrolling through the values simply because 'the less sysex this machine needs to process, the better'. The way I have set it up now is that you set a value, either with the slider or value input and a double click (on slider) or enter (on value input) confirms and sends the code. My panel will not be of any use if people want to automate parameters. The hardware unit was not build to handle that anyway. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Is your ensoniq sending "ACK" ackowledge error type sysex messages after each reception?
If you don't have a reply from the unit for every incoming requests processed, just a use a timer of 250ms to send the values like mentionned the way above. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
the global midi delay works but is useless because it only delays the messages and the delays add up and the whole thing is a very unmusical solution. So before adding the timer, I am starting with just writing out the method to send a midi CC in LUA and am having trouble retrieving the CC number from the modulator. Also is there a way to generalize this method so that I put it in the "call when modulator value changes" without having to write a method for each modulator? How can I call the CC value correctly? ccValue = panel:getModulatorByName("LFOfrq-4"):getProperty("midiMessageCtrlrNumber") is not working right and there is nowhere I can find syntax or reference to help me figure this out. Is there a document or link I am missing that would help me make sense of some of these calls? ` ccValue = panel:getModulatorByName("LFOfrq-4"):getProperty("midiMessageCtrlrNumber") CC = "B0" panel:sendMidiMessageNow(CtrlrMidiMessage(CC..midiMsg..midiValue..midiChannel)) end after I get this method working I can create timerCallback section a global midi resolution variable would be a super useful global for these older synths (as was stated in the other thread) |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Using a timer callback is good because it allows the panel to remain responsive while it does the scheduling behind the scenes. Pause messages lock the panel up. However you do it, you are limited by the bandwidth of MIDI and the processors on either end of the cable. You can call a method whenever any modulator is changed, but you'll need to include some method of working out what modulator is moved. Also, this won't allow the modulator value to be parsed as part of the calling function. Normally, you call a function from each modulator, and if you have similar code, you use that function to call another function that includes the repeated code. for midiMessageControllerNumber, you'll need to make sure that it is defined in the message section of that modulator. If you are just sending MIDI CC, you can define them without LUA. You only need to do something trickier if you need the delay. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Thanks for the reply I dont understand what a timer callback is I suppose. I thought I would figure out this CC method and then build the timer section after. Is this not the right approach? what do you mean by "for midiMessageControllerNumber, you'll need to make sure that it is defined in the message section of that modulator." which message section? I have the CC numbers all selected and working for this panel, they are causing stuck notes when automated, so I am trying to implement your "sample and send" style technique because the midi delays are not working right. I get a error with 'ccValue = panel:getModulatorByName("LFOfrq-4"):getProperty("midiMessageCtrlrNumber")'
So each modulator will need a method called when its value changes? Ugh thats a lot of work. So I am pretty sure I do need the delay so I need the code to send a |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
You define them for the modulator here. A MIDI cc message will be sent for every value change. You can throttle them with this parameter in the panel global pane.
This is the easiest way to build a panel to control a synth that responds to MIDI CC's. With the Jupiter 8 panel, I had to build the sysex messages from all of the modulators, so I didn't have them set up to send MIDI CC's. The timer callback check the value of all of the modulators and builds the relevant messages and then makes a decision about what needs to be sent to the Jupiter 8. The control of the Jupiter 8 is unusual compared to most other synths because it doesn't support MIDI CC's. I'm not sure about the OBX and what the MIDI interface supports. Basically with a timer callback you launch a timer in the background. When time has elapsed it interrupts the main code and runs the code in the callback, and then it returns to the main code. It's important that you have a way to escape out of the code (such as a counter, or some sort of condition that will stop the timer.) There are a number of callbacks running in the background such as when a modulator changes, or when a MIDI message is received. These callbacks are listening for something in the background, and when that event occurs it runs the bit of code. Yeah, it can be a lot of work, especially as you add more features, and then stuff crashes and burns, so you need to add more code to fix that. Also, did you get the email I sent to you? I got your message from our website, and sent a reply. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Yes, I already built a complete and functional panel for the OB8 using the built in CC functionality, but the resolution of the controls is too high to automate the parameters and so I must thin out the data. I did get your email, thanks I will send a reply. This issue took priority over jupiter development because I thought this panel complete but when I went to test it, was getting stuck notes. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Thanks for explaining the timer callback. I need to look at more examples of how to implement them. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
I dont understand what a timer callback is I suppose. I thought I would figure out this CC method and then build the timer section after. Is this not the right approach? So each modulator will need a method called when its value changes? Ugh thats a lot of work. Yes I do need the delay so I need the code to send a CC and a timer to sample it. Is there some example I can look at? Trying to learn this scripting syntax by only looking at examples makes it really hard. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
forget the global midi delay. It doesn't work for this purpose. In your case the delay will build up and will transfer your delayed message super slowly. if you have 100 mod value change it will send over 100 x 200ms = 20sec What you need is a function to sample the mod value every x ms and send it for each loop cycle of the timer.
Please check my very sketchy panel. the timer (1000ms) is triggered when you click the slider and sends the value every cycle.
The only con' is that it requires a click on the slider so if you use the mousewheel over the slider, it won't send. You can fix that by triggering the timer when the mouse is over the component anyway. For more about timers please read #285 (comment) Send Message with sampling_1_0_0_2022-03-24_04-20.panel.zip EDIT : And for info, the way to get the cc number of the component via LUA is : |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Wow much more elegant than my code. This is useful for anyone developing for older equipment. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
@damiensellier That's strange because everything is the same except for the TimerId number. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
That's amazing work and it works well @damiensellier. I added the necessary code for @puffer3 to run this function globally on different controls. You only need this one function: The lua CC code is: local channelOut = panel:getProperty("panelMidiOutputChannelDevice")
local statusByte = 0xb0 + (channelOut - 1) -- use this code for dynamic channel changes
local myNumber = _G[activatedCtrl]:getMidiMessage():getPropertyInt("midiMessageCtrlrNumber")
local mess = CtrlrMidiMessage({statusByte, myNumber, modValue})
panel:sendMidiMessageNow(mess)
CcValueSend = function(--[[ CtrlrModulator --]] mod, --[[ number --]] value, --[[ number --]] source)
--console("sent modValue = "..(value))
modValue = value
activatedCtrl=L(mod:getName())
end
Note that in the init (when panel loads constructor) function, we set global lua variables to lfo=panel:getModulatorByName("lfo")
resonance=panel:getModulatorByName("resonance")
So when a control named resonance or lfo is activated, they assign their names to the global variable activatedCtrl which the Timer uses to build the cc message. I tested it with graphics and it still seems to work. I think this code could work well with the Jupiter 8 Encore panel too! |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Amazing! I will play with this today. Once concern is this: I have already a panel with assigned CC's functioning properly and transmitting midi, but the actual stuck note issue happens when parameters are automated by the daw. will this workaround still work if "when modulator value is changed" is used instead of "when mouse is down over component"? The panel was working well with one parameter tweaked while playing, but the goal is some level of automation. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
You can start the timer by clicking a dedicated button when you are playing the automation . something like a "read" button on the panel (on value change Off to On). this one would starts the timer but requires removing the stop timer instruction on stall and adding one when the read button goes from on to off. As a reminder here are the source filters : Or you can even let the timer run forever. If you send values every 250ms I'm not sure how hard on the cpu it can be, I bet it would be ok. Just try it. It's an idea :) Edit: for automations from DAW you need this table with all the last cc values anyway in order to limit the flow of data and send the message only if value is changed. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
I think the code from @damiensellier works fine without the onMouseDown event. Here I have moved the timer trigger into the cCvalueSend = function(--[[ CtrlrModulator --]] mod --[[ number --]], value --[[ number --]], source)
--console("sent modValue = "..(value))
modValue = value
activatedCtrl = L(mod:getName())
sendCcMessageAllow = true
timer:setCallback(1, timerCallback)
timer:startTimer(1, 1000) -- will send modValue every 1000ms on click until modValue stalls
end
|
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
My goal is to be able to send a fine tuneable amount of CC's to the synth because the current stream of information seems to be causing stuck MIDI notes. Sampling the controls to a table with a timer seems like everyones solution. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
Hi Damien, This is your original example with the mouse down In the screenshot I start at
Send Message with sampling_1_0_checking midi send_2022-03-25_10-34.zip |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
just move the slider smoothly without stopping for about 10 sec and you'll see you'll get 10 messages sent. take your latest panel which works well, and change the timer interval to 200ms and you'll get a lot of messages during a 10 sec move. It's not happening when triggered on value change. Here is what I have : sends once only after releasing the slider |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
Oh I see, but in Windows on 5.3.201 it doesn't seem as responsive and still if I move the slider quickly (at 200ms) , as I was always doing, it only sends out the landing value, but if you move the dial more gently it works as you describe, so yes I misunderstood what was being asked. Still that code I posted might be useful for the JP8 ENCORE panel if the ENCORE is choking with large sysex sends. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Oh yeah I see. I forgot to comment the console messages, it's way smoother without them. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
My panel is for an OB8 with tauntek MIDI installed not an Ensonic just fyi. The CC's are causing stuck notes when sequencing a note pattern with added automation to parameters. I am going to try a few short (5 and 20ms) global panel delay tests and see if that alleviates the problem on the OB8. I also emailed the Tauntek man himself who made this MIDI kit and asked about a ceiling that the Z80 can handle. Working on a table of modulator values rn. One suspicion I had was that the DAW was sending midi notes and the panel CC information and maybe they are getting jumbled up? Is this possible? Should I be routing midi messages from the daw into the Ctrlr panel and then out? I was there late at night but I do think i tried both ways. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Oh alright, I made a mistake, there's several discussion at the same time with related topics and another was about an ensoniq eps16, jupiter8 and yours. Nevermind, forget about that sysex confirmation message though. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Here is a list of the CC's would it be possible to use JSON instead of a table? I am trying to learn json for patch storage. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
Hi @puffer3 If you need to pass all these parameters through the one function and eventually save as json to file, I would create a table of these values, like: --global
patchData={
...
["Osc1 PW"]={ccnumber=17,value=0},
...
}
then when that dial is triggered pass the cc# to the timer as discussed: function process(mod, value, source)
local n = L(mod:getName())
modValue = value
patchData[n].value = value -- store the value in the table
-- when you save the changes to a file you can convert this table to json with the value assigned to the modulator
-- no need to loop through each modulator recording each value
-- just do json.encode(patchData) and save to file. It can then be re-read back into the panel
activatedCtrl = n
ccnumber = patchData[n].ccnumber
-- and pick up this global in the timer or you just do
--local myNumber = _G[activatedCtrl]:getMidiMessage():getPropertyInt("midiMessageCtrlrNumber")
-- IN THE TIMER as discussed before - either way
sendCcMessageAllow = true
timer:setCallback(1, timerCallback)
timer:startTimer(1, 1000) -- will send modValue every 1000ms on click until modValue stalls
end
|
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
ok here is a method that creates a table that collects all modulators in the order they appear in the above document, and prints them at the end. I renamed the modulators to be closer to the document so things would be easier. Next I have to make a timer that hopefully wont crash the computer. ` function collectModulators() PatchDataTable = {} portSpeed = panel:getModulatorByName("portSpeed"):getModulatorValue() --create string concatenated from tabel --print Patch Data end ` |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
That should work! Here's a more efficient way of doing the same thing: patchDataTable = {
{name="portSpeed",value=panel:getModulatorByName("portSpeed"):getModulatorValue()},
{name="progVolume",value=panel:getModulatorByName("progVolume"):getModulatorValue()},
...
}-- //end patchDataTable
local str=""
for i,v in ipairs (patchDataTable) do
str=string.format("%s %d",str,v.value)
end
console (str)
but I would avoid that long string of integers; reading it back would be too error prone (but not impossible), but with the table structure above, which is an ordered matrix of values in the order you want (probably not necessary to have it ordered), you can easily convert such a table to json for reading back into the panel, which you could only do with difficulty using your way.
prints
|
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
thanks ! It did seem clunky how I was doing it. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
This is the complete example saving as json and loading back to json: (1) SAVEpatchDataTable={
"portSpeed",
"progVolume"
}
myMethod = function(--[[ CtrlrModulator --]] mod --[[ number --]], value --[[ number --]], source)
local t = {}
for _, v in ipairs(patchDataTable) do
t[v] = panel:getModulatorByName(v):getModulatorValue()
end
json_str = json.encode(t)
console(json_str)
--{"portSpeed":48,"progVolume":99} -- for example
end
(2) LOADOnce you've loaded the json string panel:setPropertyInt("panelMidiPauseOut",0) -- !PAUSE SENDING MIDI
for k, v in pairs(obj) do
panel:getModulatorByName(k):setModulatorValue(v,false,true,false)
end
panel:setPropertyInt("panelMidiPauseOut",1) -- !ALLOW SENDING MIDI
|
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Hi i have a few versions I switch between because they dont all do everything. I cant load images in 5.3.198 so I also use 5.6.23 and 5.3.163 Mac seems to have loads of issues. I have a PC coming so I can switch and just develop image assets on my mac. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Oh okay, but anyway I have fixed it. The problem is that you need to initialize all See attached panel! |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
My Hero! I have always depended on the open sourced kindness of strangers. I knew I wasn't initializing properly. Ok now I will get these patches saving properly and then will have to work towards the parameter sampling functionality. Thank you @dnaldoog |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
Excellent- great to hear @puffer3 ! |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
-
|
@puffer3 you can try the latest mac version, it's available on @Godlike-Productions website. It's working really well and doesn't have the image resource drop-down menu bug. |
Beta Was this translation helpful? Give feedback.
This is the complete example saving as json and loading back to json:
EDIT 3/26/2022 v 4-- changed bug in code
EDIT 3/26/2022 v 5-- updated patchTableData to indexed table
(1) SAVE
patchDataTable={ "portSpeed", "progVolume" } myMethod = function(--[[ CtrlrModulator --]] mod --[[ number --]], value --[[ number --]], source) local t = {} for _, v in ipairs(patchDataTable) do t[v] = panel:getModulatorByName(v):getModulatorValue() end json_str = json.encode(t) console(json_str) --{"portSpeed":48,"progVolume":99} -- for example endfileToWrite:replaceWithText(json_str, true, true)(2) LOAD
Once you've loaded the json string
{"portSpeed":48,"progVolum…